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Old 05-16-2007   #21 (permalink)
fuscia
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

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Originally Posted by ComplexNumber View Post
wrong meaning.
it doesn't matter if that muscle turns to stone or not or something. basically, there are 3 options:
a) you stay the same
b) the muscle magically dematerialises and you go back to how you started before you started body building.
c) it turns to flab and you get fat.

option c is the correct one.
in response to 'a': if one were to stop the muscle building exercise, it is unlikely that one would remain the same, though it is possible.

in response to 'b': if one were to stop exercising and reduce calorie intake to amount it was before exercising, this is very likely (actually, for a while, the person could take in more calories than before while still having more muscle mass, at least. there's probably an additional benefit from exercise that makes insulin absorbtion more efficient after a period of exercise). if one stopped exercising, yet maintained the same amount of calories, that person would get fat. maybe this is what you're thinking of. if so, that's quite different than saying muscle will turn to fat. calories can contribute to the building of muscle, or the storage of fat. in order for the building of muscle to occur, that muscle has to be stimulated to grow (fat does not need to be so stimulated). muscle and fat are different.

in response to 'c': muscle does not turn into fat.
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Old 05-16-2007   #22 (permalink)
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Talking Re: How to become a real muscled man?

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Originally Posted by Extreme Coder View Post
Just out of interest, where do you live Zdravko?

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"В началото Бог сътвори небето и земята" (Бит. 1:1)
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Old 05-17-2007   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

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Originally Posted by ComplexNumber View Post
you are best off just building up muscle TONE. not muscle size.

btw you do realise that when you stop exercising, all that muscle turns to fat, don't you?
The muscle "tone" most people refer to is a misnomer and is usually the visual effect of a small degree of hypertrophy. Go to a rehab ward of a hospital and observe some car accident victims, you will see the result of hypertoned and hypotoned muscles.

Now, lets clear some things up about fat and muscle before I get onto helping the OP specifically. As fuscia has already done a fair job of explaining, muscle cells and fat cells are different. You have a pretty much fixed number of muscle cells, working out can increase the size] of these...Hypertrophy.

Fat cells on the other hand can undergo hyperplasia, an increase in the number of cells. When you stop exercising, you might experience atrophy of muscle, ie. shrinking of the cell size, with simultaneous hyperplasia of fat cells due this excess energy intake. This gives the illusion that muscle may have turned to fat. Instead, the excess energy has created extra fat cells which simply fill the space that larger muscle cells once occupied, fuelling the myth.

As fuscia also pointed out, this effect won't happen immediately, as the hypertophied muscle from exercise will help offset decreased energy requirements from not exercising. Hopefully that detail is sufficient.

I wouldn't normally double post, but I shall make an exception and write something about how to gain muscle for the OP, in a separate post. Might take some time, I'll try to be detailed.
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Old 05-17-2007   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

Hi Zdravko,

I too weigh 55kg and whilst I'm not trying to increase you muscle size, I can certainly help you with some tips to do it.

Firstly, you are going to have to take up some sort of resistance training. Whether that be at a public gym, school/uni gym or at home with your own equipment (if you decide to buy it) is entirely up to you. That decision can influence the specific exercises you can do, so I'll try to keep it as generic as possible, using free weights.

Two great exercises have already been mentioned, with good reason. The squat and deadlift are awesome and certainly do help with overall muscle mass, as well as in the specific muscles they use the most. I will list a general exercise program you can try, with links to demonstrations of each one. Then I will let you know some principles to follow and extra information. You must still see a gym instructor or alike to get shown the correct technique for each exercise, otherwise you are putting yourself at risk.

Monday -- Exercise -- Sets -- Repetitions Per Set

Barbell (BB) Squats 3x12
BB Stiff Legged Deadlifts 3x12
BB Lunges 3x12
BB Standing Calf raises 3x15

Wednesday

BB Close Grip Bench Press 3x12
BB Upright Rows 3x12
BB Bench Press 3x12
Dumbbell (DB) Supine Triceps Extension 3x12

Friday

BB Deadlift 3x12
Wide-Grip Pronated Chin ups 3x8
BB Bent over row 3x12
BB Standing Bicep Curls 3x12

That is not a definitive program, there are a million and one possible variations. It should be a good start. I used the one site for many of the links, it was far quicker than finding the best for each and that site gets high pageranks, overall it's very good. The days you workout are your choice, that is just a guide because having a day rest between session is a good idea at this stage.

To work out the weight you need for each exercise, find something where you can do 12 reps comfortably enough but with quite an effort in first set, rest 1 minute, do another 12, rest 1 minute, then find the final 12 hard so you might only manage 10. When you can do 15 reps in the 3rd set of an exercise, it's time to make a small increase in weight.

In this case, 1 minute is always the rest to have between sets if you can. 2 minutes could be ok, but 1 is better. During each set, try to make the repetition nice and controlled, moving the weight slowly both ways. This helps maximise the muscle building effectiveness and is different to strength training.

On the nutrition side of things, half an hour before a workout have something like one of the following:
- A glass of Milo with milk
- A tub of yoghurt
- A tuna or chicken sandwich
- A banana or apple and a glass or milk

A similar snack within about half an hour after your workout is also good.

Your general meals should basically be well balanced, including rices, pastas, potatoes, red meat, chicken, fish, green veggies, nuts, all other veggies. Try to split your daily food into 5-6 meals, rather than just 3.

It's also important to get enough energy overall throughout the day. In fact, you want to be a little bit over your requirements. To help you work out how much energy you need, the following link is the best I've found of its kind.

Energy Calculator - Daily Calculator

I have probably left lots out, but that is probably long enough for now. Hope you find it useful :-)
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Old 05-17-2007   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

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Sofia, Bulgaria. I will have to fill in my profile.
dude, you're in home of olympic lifting. one of the problems with olympic lifting is the need for proper form. you could probably easily find some good instruction there. bikeboy's suggested workout is pretty solid, though, and those exercises are easier to learn. my enthusiasm for olympic lifting is for the athletic benefits rather than the muscular benefits. some would argue that powerlifting has a greater effect on mass than olympic lifting.
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Old 05-17-2007   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

Thanks for the essay bikeboy. I could make use from it, I am in a similar condition to Zdravko.

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Old 05-17-2007   #27 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

bikeboy, fuscia
i don't care if muscle turns to cryptonite or something. what it turns to is not the issue. the fact is, you become fat and shapeless after you stop excercising..
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Old 05-17-2007   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

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bikeboy, fuscia
i don't care if muscle turns to cryptonite or something. what it turns to is not the issue. the fact is, you become fat and shapeless after you stop excercising..
that's simply not true. it is only one possibility. moreover, you were warning the op not to gain muscle, because of this. if the op is going to get fat, he will get fat at a faster rate the less muscle he has, because more of his excess consumption will be turning to fat rather than supporting a larger muscle mass.
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Old 05-17-2007   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

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not so fast. its pretty much well known. if you make a statement thats contrary to popular belief, the onus is on you.
so according to whom is it fiction?
Burden of Proof

IOW, you made the positive assertion that muscle "turns into" fat. The burden is on you to prove that. Good luck.
In case it wasn't apparent, sarcasm is yet another free service I offer.

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Old 05-17-2007   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

bikeboy, thank you very much for the great and detailed instructions! I will try to accommodate to some of your ideas and then I will report the results.
Thanks!
"В началото Бог сътвори небето и земята" (Бит. 1:1)
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Old 05-17-2007   #31 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

fuscia
believe what you want to believe then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by utabintarbo View Post
Burden of Proof

IOW, you made the positive assertion that muscle "turns into" fat. The burden is on you to prove that. Good luck.
you forgot to read the follow up posts. duh!

Last edited by ComplexNumber : 05-17-2007 at 12:43 PM.
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Old 05-17-2007   #32 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

Can you, the ones with the "fat idea", stop plaguing my first topic in this forum?
"В началото Бог сътвори небето и земята" (Бит. 1:1)
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Old 05-17-2007   #33 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

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you forgot to read the follow up posts. duh!
They did not change where the burden lies. Have a nice day.
In case it wasn't apparent, sarcasm is yet another free service I offer.

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Old 05-17-2007   #34 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

Zdravko, I would try out the program bikerboy has outlined. It seems pretty well-thought-out for a starter. The only thing I would add is that you should pay attention to your body and do what works best for you. Vary the sets, reps, and exercises until you hit upon the combination that feels best. If you pay attention, you will recognize this happening.

Good Luck.
In case it wasn't apparent, sarcasm is yet another free service I offer.

Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay -- and claims a halo for his dishonesty.---- Robert A. Heinlein
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Old 05-17-2007   #35 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

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Originally Posted by fuscia View Post
dude, you're in home of olympic lifting. one of the problems with olympic lifting is the need for proper form. you could probably easily find some good instruction there. bikeboy's suggested workout is pretty solid, though, and those exercises are easier to learn. my enthusiasm for olympic lifting is for the athletic benefits rather than the muscular benefits. some would argue that powerlifting has a greater effect on mass than olympic lifting.
Yeah I agree the olympic lifts are great, I would still recommend learning them even without an initial program incorporating them. The squat and deadlift are modelled on parts of the olympic lifts.

You also finished off the fat/muscle discussion well so I won't write any more about it, unless someone wants to discuss the issue somewhere else :-)

Quote:
Originally Posted by utabintarbo View Post
The only thing I would add is that you should pay attention to your body and do what works best for you. Vary the sets, reps, and exercises until you hit upon the combination that feels best. If you pay attention, you will recognize this happening.
Yes that's a good point too. Any program left the same for too long will start to lose its effect. So vary things up, find alternative exercises for some muscles every few weeks if you like, it will all help. The general rule is that as you lower reps and increase the weight, you tend more to strength training, but it doesn't hurt to spend 6 weeks doing that as it will spur on the adaptation of your body.
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Old 05-21-2007   #36 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

Thank you very much for the suggestions.
"В началото Бог сътвори небето и земята" (Бит. 1:1)
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Old 05-22-2007   #37 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

here's a good site - Welcome to CrossFit: Forging Elite Fitness

check the 'exercises & demos' section. there are a lot of good video clips on a variety of exercises (fairly in depth, too).
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Old 05-23-2007   #38 (permalink)
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Default Re: How to become a real muscled man?

my way is to eat 2500 calories with a 20/50/30 split of fat/carbs/protein,
get a good dose of oily fish or chicken at least every other day and eat starchy carbs and leave out the sugary simple carbs, as for weights, i think other people have pretty much covered it, just remmber to do back weights too, otherwise youll end up hunched over.

@the person who said muscle turns into fat, your wrong, muscle is an expensive body commodity, it burns 15 calories per unit compared to 4 calories per unit of fat, thats why big muscly people can eat more, when you dont eat enough or the body decides you dont need the muscle it turns on itself and breaks itself down, if you stop doing exercise but still consistantly eat lots, it wont turn into fat, youll just gain fat and lose muscle.
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