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Old 06-06-2008   #21 (permalink)
kevmartin
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Default Re: Is calling someone "whitey" a racial epithet?

The problem, to my mind, of insisting on literal-only interpretations of words is that language is a form of communication. People do not communicate with simple literal definitions. They communicate based on accepted meanings, so insisting on literalness in a communication scenario becomes pedantic and counter-productive. there is also a very strong argument regarding the changing meaning of words over time. This is a very real thing (otherwise we could all refer to medieval dictionaries for our literal definitions and they would be exactly the same as referring to modern dictionaries).
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Old 06-06-2008   #22 (permalink)
Rasczak
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Default Re: Is calling someone "whitey" a racial epithet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevmartin View Post
The problem, to my mind, of insisting on literal-only interpretations of words is that language is a form of communication. People do not communicate with simple literal definitions. They communicate based on accepted meanings, so insisting on literalness in a communication scenario becomes pedantic and counter-productive. there is also a very strong argument regarding the changing meaning of words over time. This is a very real thing (otherwise we could all refer to medieval dictionaries for our literal definitions and they would be exactly the same as referring to modern dictionaries).
So you don't think discrimination based on skin color is racism anymore? I'm saying it is.
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Old 06-07-2008   #23 (permalink)
Daquan13
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Default Re: Is calling someone "whitey" a racial epithet?

I don't call anyone any of those names.

I address them by their birth names or the name that they would like to be called. Or I'll just say Hi.

I treat others, yes children included, with the utmost respect, so I expect the same from them.

I've heard some young Afro-American teens as young as 13 at the school where I tutor children, say; "Hey, N, what's up, N?" Especially to their own race. I just laugh and shake my head.

Then they'll thrown in a few cuss-words. In my presence, they'll do this and then say; Sorry, sir." I smile and say; "No problem".

While they are getting their education, it seems as though they've left their manners at home.

But instead of telling them that they shouldn't use those words, I just let it go. I don't want any trouble from them.
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Old 06-07-2008   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is calling someone "whitey" a racial epithet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daquan13 View Post
I don't call anyone any of those names.

I address them by their birth names or the name that they would like to be called. Or I'll just say Hi.

I treat others, yes children included, with the utmost respect, so I expect the same from them.

I've heard some young Afro-American teens as young as 13 at the school where I tutor children, say; "Hey, N, what's up, N?" Especially to their own race. I just laugh and shake my head.

Then they'll thrown in a few cuss-words. In my presence, they'll do this and then say; Sorry, sir." I smile and say; "No problem".

While they are getting their education, it seems as though they've left their manners at home.

But instead of telling them that they shouldn't use those words, I just let it go. I don't want any trouble from them.
Hey Daquan
Well the hope is that correcting them will prohibit the next verbal out break in public or other wise..but yes more than likely because of moral decline in the home and abroad they will backlash with a smart mouth attitude. So I understand your step back here..I too have been there done that among teens who act out verbally. Some will apologize, most expect a pat on the back for their words of cruelty. Now..shave off 25/30 years and the world was a different place back then..I personally think there was more respect among different nationalities..

Sherri
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Old 06-07-2008   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is calling someone "whitey" a racial epithet?

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Originally Posted by Rasczak View Post
Basically, when race matters, its racist. I think it may be more harmful (or backwards) saying that it is ok for one race to do something, but not another, than using a term like we're talking about.

When you're just instulting someone, its really only words, but when you start playing around with premissions to do one thing or another, and applying them or prohibiting something based on race, that's another thing altogether.

I do take a literal interpretation of most words I use. I like it that way - when words mean something. This is counter to how the word "racist" is abused and thrown around indiscriminately, which as evidenced in this thread, has diluted or obscured the real ugliness of racism.
HI Ras..
I believe you slice the pie with no left over edges..that is to say..cut and dry when it comes to verbalizing the exactness with terminology per subject..extreme and direct..no patience for side additives..and understandable with your expression of self..

You said this below..

When you're just instulting someone, its really only words, but when you start playing around with premissions to do one thing or another, and applying them or prohibiting something based on race, that's another thing altogether.

I agree, but ignorance and disrespect plays a part here with most people verbalizing what they say..just a lack of pure respect for color regardless, so they add racial slur to make a point.

I use to think that black people were indeed different as to their performance of dancing..wow..they had it going on..but then the arrival of many white dancers as well came onto the seen..I say this because of what I began to see with television and dancing. Its just a different skin color..God has made us all different..I am sure there is added differences culturally, as we see this..but human per human..we are all the same..

Why poeple insist on it being differently, behooves me.

Sherri
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Old 06-07-2008   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is calling someone "whitey" a racial epithet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rasczak View Post
So you don't think discrimination based on skin color is racism anymore? I'm saying it is.
Well if you want to get into definitions and literal interpretation, to answer your question I would need to know what you mean by discrimination.

Quote:
Discrination: Distinguishing or differentiating. One of the principal abilities underlying any kind of cognition. However, in moral and political philosophy, the term is often confined to the unfavourable treatment of particular groups of individuals, on prejudiced and irrelevant grounds. Confusing these two senses can lead to the view that almost any description of people is politically incorrect.
Source: The Oxford Dictionary of Philosophy. Copyright © 1994, 1996, 2005 by Oxford University Press.

And, for the hell of it, the same source on 'racism':
Quote:
The inability or refusal to recognize the rights, needs, dignity, or value of people of particular races or geographical origins. More widely, the devaluation of various traits of character or intelligence as ‘typical’ of particular peoples. The category of race may itself be challenged, as implying an inference from trivial superficial differences of appearance to allegedly significant underlying differences of nature; increasingly evolutionary evidence suggests that the dispersal of one original people into different geographical locations is a relatively recent and genetically insignificant matter.

Last edited by kevmartin : 06-07-2008 at 05:11 PM.
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Old 06-08-2008   #27 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is calling someone "whitey" a racial epithet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevmartin View Post
Well if you want to get into definitions and literal interpretation, to answer your question I would need to know what you mean by discrimination.



Source: The Oxford Dictionary of Philosophy. Copyright © 1994, 1996, 2005 by Oxford University Press.

And, for the hell of it, the same source on 'racism':
I was specific and perfectly clear. I said "discrimination based on skin color." There is nothing wrong with discrimination in itself - everyone discriminates when they choose baby sitters, restaurants, doctors, etc. When you discriminate based on race, ie "I don't want white people to teach my children," that is racism.

American Heritage dictionary:
1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

Oxford:
• noun 1 the belief that there are characteristics, abilities, or qualities specific to each race. 2 discrimination against or antagonism towards other races.
Eric
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