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Old 09-28-2007   #21 (permalink)
MRiGnS
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

I think school is the right place for children to learn how to respect many others, you don't see that variety of people at home, well, in TV. But that's not the same.

Learning by doing. They not just only know they have to respect others, they need the expercience of how it's done. You can't learn to respect others if you're all alone.
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Old 09-28-2007   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

Well, children are read books about hetrosexual people in schools... isn't that forcing sexuality on them?

Why is it okay to do it when it involves straight people but not gay? Double standards much?
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Old 09-28-2007   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

I thought fairies were asexual?
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Old 09-30-2007   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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Wow, you actually came right out and said government shools have more authority than parents. I wonder if you'd change your tune if said government school had decided kids need to know about Noah and the Ark.
well i dont know about the US, but kids ARE taught about noah and the ark in school, in RE class, there also taught about genesis, and also about judaism and also about buddhist philosophy, all in basic detail, but like any education, the teacher can only go so far and its the students own interest that must take it further in study, which is why state schools teach a bit of everything they can within reason.
that said, do i think that should be read to second graders? (which is 5-6 yr olds IIRC) nope there to young to deal with that kind of social issue. get them to read it in an english literature class when their 12-13 and id have no problem with it.
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Old 09-30-2007   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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Originally Posted by hairy_Palms View Post
that said, do i think that should be read to second graders? (which is 5-6 yr olds IIRC) nope there to young to deal with that kind of social issue. get them to read it in an english literature class when their 12-13 and id have no problem with it.
The average 2nd grader is 7 in the U.S. It's grade level plus 5. Maybe UK is different.
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Old 09-30-2007   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

i wouldnt have a problem with a book like that being read in second grade. we just read the bluest eye in school, and one of the reasons all the blacks felt worthless was because the books they read in school only showed happy white families with one boy and one girl, a cat and dog, etc.... the american dream.

by teaching kids nowadays that there are only straight people, and everything else is wrong, we would be doing the same thing.
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Old 09-30-2007   #27 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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Originally Posted by Wofl View Post
i wouldnt have a problem with a book like that being read in second grade. we just read the bluest eye in school, and one of the reasons all the blacks felt worthless was because the books they read in school only showed happy white families with one boy and one girl, a cat and dog, etc.... the american dream.

by teaching kids nowadays that there are only straight people, and everything else is wrong, we would be doing the same thing.
Government schools aren't there to teach my kids what to believe about things like homosexuality. They are there to teach them how to read, write, do math, and that's about it as far as second grade goes. And they can't even do that worth a shit. Probably because they are busy indoctrinating them to be good little government subjects.
Eric
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Old 09-30-2007   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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Originally Posted by Rasczak View Post
Government schools aren't there to teach my kids what to believe about things like homosexuality. They are there to teach them how to read, write, do math, and that's about it as far as second grade goes. And they can't even do that worth a shit. Probably because they are busy indoctrinating them to be good little government subjects.
So why is it okay for them to tell stories with hetrosexual people in them then? You can't have your cake and eat it too!
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Old 09-30-2007   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

so you agree that we should end school after ~8 years or so?
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Old 09-30-2007   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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Originally Posted by User1.0 View Post
So why is it okay for them to tell stories with hetrosexual people in them then? You can't have your cake and eat it too!
Well, for starters, virtually every second grader out there is the child of hetrosexual people barring the use of turkey basters and petri dishes. There is nothing controversial about being hetrosexual.

However, there are a variety of views on homosexuality that people are entitled to and can hold without infringing on anyone else's welfare.

Second graders should not be indoctrinated into ANY view of homosexuality, positive or negative.
Eric
"For whoever habitually suppresses the truth in the interests of tact will produce a deformity from the womb of his thought." -Sir Basil H. Liddel-Hart
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Old 09-30-2007   #31 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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Originally Posted by Rasczak View Post
Well, for starters, virtually every second grader out there is the child of hetrosexual people barring the use of turkey basters and petri dishes. There is nothing controversial about being hetrosexual.
There is nothing controversial about being homosexual and I think you are lacking in just how many homosexual parents there are out there. For you to discredit a child's parents relationship is quite cruel.
Quote:
However, there are a variety of views on homosexuality that people are entitled to and can hold without infringing on anyone else's welfare.
Until they deem one to be normal and one to be evil, and in turn will only expose their children to one form of relationship, shunning the other out of main stream society.
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Second graders should not be indoctrinated into ANY view of homosexuality, positive or negative.
No, children should be exposed to enriching and loving relationships between two adults who love and respect each other. What does or does not dangle between their legs should be ignored.

Homosexuals have hetrosexual relationships exposed upon them everyday, why is the reverse so controversial?
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Old 09-30-2007   #32 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

I have a problem with pushing homosexuality on kids. I do not have a problem with teaching them fine literature which happens to have a homosexual couple in it. It's about motivation. Too many people do things out of fear. Fear of homosexuals. Fear that the kids will grow up and hate. Hatred has nothing to do with sexuality or gender or race. Some people just hate.
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Old 09-30-2007   #33 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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I have a problem with pushing homosexuality on kids. I do not have a problem with teaching them fine literature which happens to have a homosexual couple in it.
Every children's story with a homosexual couple is 'pushing homosexuality on children'. Where as a children's story with a hetrosexual couple is merely a story, as non eventful as the day is long. When does a simple story with a homosexual couple suddenly become 'pushing views' on children?
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Old 09-30-2007   #34 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

Fuck it. Just show them gay porn. Bypass the fairy tales and get right to the nitty gritty. Nothing wrong with one man having anal sex with another man? May as well show it to the kids. And no use waiting until second grade. Kindergarten for cripes sakes. Preschool even.
Eric
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Old 09-30-2007   #35 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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Originally Posted by User1.0 View Post
Every children's story with a homosexual couple is 'pushing homosexuality on children'. Where as a children's story with a hetrosexual couple is merely a story, as non eventful as the day is long. When does a simple story with a homosexual couple suddenly become 'pushing views' on children?
As I said, it's about motivation. I don't want anyone pushing any views on kids. They need to be allowed to grow up to the point that they can make their own minds up. I do not agree that every story that involves homosexuality is 'pushing homosexuality on children' anymore than stories that involve heterosexual couples is pushing heterosexuality on kids. But you could push your views on children. In fact, many do. Many conservative people who would be appalled at the idea of homosexuality are the absolute worst about pushing their views on children. They make me sick. Imagine telling a 5-year-old that he needs to be saved so that he doesn't go to hell. I've got no use for that kind of fear-based manipulation. I think it's sad that homosexual people are discriminated against. But I think the knee-jerk reaction gets a little out of hand sometimes.
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Old 09-30-2007   #36 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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Originally Posted by Rasczak View Post
Fuck it. Just show them gay porn. Bypass the fairy tales and get right to the nitty gritty. Nothing wrong with one man having anal sex with another man? May as well show it to the kids. And no use waiting until second grade. Kindergarten for cripes sakes. Preschool even.
Yes, because a romantic relationship between two people (male/male, female/female, male/female) is on the same wave length as male homosexual porn. Me thinks your issue is with homosexuality and very little about what children are taught in schools.
What about this......
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Originally Posted by Rasczak View Post
Fuck it. Just show them porn. Bypass the fairy tales and get right to the nitty gritty. Nothing wrong with one person having sex with another? May as well show it to the kids. And no use waiting until second grade. Kindergarten for cripes sakes. Preschool even.
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Old 09-30-2007   #37 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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Originally Posted by Rasczak View Post
Fuck it. Just show them gay porn. Bypass the fairy tales and get right to the nitty gritty. Nothing wrong with one man having anal sex with another man? May as well show it to the kids. And no use waiting until second grade. Kindergarten for cripes sakes. Preschool even.
I wouldn't show children porn of any kind. I also wouldn't want them to see depictions of violence. There are a lot of things I wouldn't want young children to see or hear.
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Old 09-30-2007   #38 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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Yes, because a romantic relationship between two people (male/male, female/female, male/female) is on the same wave length as male homosexual porn. Me thinks your issue is with homosexuality and very little about what children are taught in schools.
What about this......
Who are you to pass judgement on people who appear in porn? What gives you the authority to decide what is romantic and appropriate or obscene? What makes you the moral arbiter?

By not allowing gay porn to be shown in schools to elementary age children, you run the severe risk of them learning that some men put their penis in another man's rectum without the aid of a government school employee. How devastating and disastrous would that be?

Tell me what your problem is with showing gay porn to school children. Why do you draw the line there? And you better not be judgemental or homophobic about it.
Eric
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Old 09-30-2007   #39 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

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Originally Posted by Rasczak View Post
Fuck it. Just show them gay porn. Bypass the fairy tales and get right to the nitty gritty. Nothing wrong with one man having anal sex with another man? May as well show it to the kids. And no use waiting until second grade. Kindergarten for cripes sakes. Preschool even.
Lol, you can't compare a simple story with porn, that's ridiculous...

They don't have to change the bible to adam and evo, or ada and eve.

But it's not ok to forbid stories just because there is a homosexual couple in it.

every 10th child is homosexual itself, what do they learn of the fact that their sexuality is banned from school?

They will grow up thinking being freaks...
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Old 09-30-2007   #40 (permalink)
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Default Re: Should a gay fairy tale book be read to second graders?

And we return to the ignore list......
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