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Old 06-23-2008   #1 (permalink)
Iandefor
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Default Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

I just read this in the NYT.

Quote:
As Senator Barack Obama courted voters in Iowa last December, Representative Keith Ellison, the country’s first Muslim congressman, stepped forward eagerly to help.
Mr. Ellison believed that Mr. Obama’s message of unity resonated deeply with American Muslims. He volunteered to speak on Mr. Obama’s behalf at a mosque in Cedar Rapids, one of the nation’s oldest Muslim enclaves. But before the rally could take place, aides to Mr. Obama asked Mr. Ellison to cancel the trip because it might stir controversy.
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Old 06-24-2008   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

I saw this article too while reading my Kindle last night. I was chuckling the entire time.

Among other things, the Obama campaign wouldn't let some Muslim women wear their scarf over their head while sitting behind him for one of his speeches.

There is nothing new under the sun. Certainly not Obama. This is the quintessential licking your finger and sticking it in the air to see what way the wind is blowing before making a decision.

Even Bush has been to mosques and he isn't running for anything.

The funny thing is, most of them will vote for Obama anyway.
Eric
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Old 06-24-2008   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

It's a little frustrating. For a while he seemed to represent something fresh- now he just looks like a hack.
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Old 06-24-2008   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

Now you know what I've known from the beginning. Was this really your first clue?
Eric
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Old 06-24-2008   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

Not really; I haven't been over-pleased with him for a while now. But when he first announced his intention to run he seemed like a breath of fresh air.

This is just a shitty thing to do, though. You don't announce your support for an unpopular minority and then give them the cold shoulder the moment it becomes inconvenient.
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Old 06-24-2008   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iandefor View Post
Not really; I haven't been over-pleased with him for a while now. But when he first announced his intention to run he seemed like a breath of fresh air.

This is just a shitty thing to do, though. You don't announce your support for an unpopular minority and then give them the cold shoulder the moment it becomes inconvenient.
No, you sure don't. Not if you're honest, consistent, and trustworthy.
Eric
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Old 06-24-2008   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

Seems like politics to me. An ugly, ugly business.

Can there ever be such a thing as complete honesty in politics? Perhaps one has a better chance after winning office, of showing true colors and 'doing the right thing'.
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Old 06-24-2008   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

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Originally Posted by kevmartin View Post
Seems like politics to me. An ugly, ugly business.

Can there ever be such a thing as complete honesty in politics? Perhaps one has a better chance after winning office, of showing true colors and 'doing the right thing'.
That's one way to rationalize his lack of integrity. "He's just lying now so he can be elected. Once he's elected, it'll be great. His lying is for the greater good."
Eric
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Old 06-24-2008   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

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Originally Posted by kevmartin View Post
Seems like politics to me. An ugly, ugly business.

Can there ever be such a thing as complete honesty in politics? Perhaps one has a better chance after winning office, of showing true colors and 'doing the right thing'.
All I can say is "I sure hope so." In the meantime, I'm going to exercise my judgment and say I'm not impressed with this particular turnaround.
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Old 06-27-2008   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

Ellison's speech would have presented lots of risk, no real payoff.

There's currently a major whisper campaign to paint Obama as a Muslim. One email circulating says that Obama was sworn in on a Koran (which was Keith Ellison).

Also, you've got the possibility of a Muslim version of the Rev Wright and Pfleger controversy. 527 groups would eat that up...

Obama's message hasn't changed, although he needs to be more cautious about stirring up needless religious controversies.

Last edited by yaaarrrgg : 06-27-2008 at 11:31 AM.
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Old 06-27-2008   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

Quote:
Originally Posted by yaaarrrgg View Post
Ellison's speech would have presented lots of risk, no real payoff.

There's currently a major whisper campaign to paint Obama as a Muslim. One email circulating says that Obama was sworn in on a Koran (which was Keith Ellison).

Also, you've got the possibility of a Muslim version of the Rev Wright and Pfleger controversy. 527 groups would eat that up...

His message hasn't changed, although he needs to be more cautious about stirring up needless religious controversies.
Major whisper campaign?
Eric
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Old 06-27-2008   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

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Originally Posted by Rasczak View Post
Major whisper campaign?
Even Sherri here thinks he's Muslim.
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Old 06-27-2008   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

Quote:
Originally Posted by yaaarrrgg View Post
Even Sherri here thinks he's Muslim.
So, Sherri posting a scam email is evidence of a major whisper campaign?

Why would any critic of Obama need to make religious stuff up when all they need to do is listen to what people in his orbit say to know he surrounds himself with hateful extremists?

Moderate milk toast American Muslims are a step up from the types Obama has been lining the pews with for the last two decades.
Eric
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Old 06-27-2008   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rasczak View Post
Why would any critic of Obama need to make religious stuff up when all they need to do is listen to what people in his orbit say to know he surrounds himself with hateful extremists?
Because some wackaloons can't tell the difference between a Muslim and a suicide bomber.
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Old 06-27-2008   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

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Originally Posted by Iandefor View Post
Because some wackaloons can't tell the difference between a Muslim and a suicide bomber.
Sadly its true.

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Old 06-27-2008   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

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Originally Posted by Iandefor View Post
Because some wackaloons can't tell the difference between a Muslim and a suicide bomber.


What percentage of suicide bombers who've killed in the last five years are Muslim? What most people get, is that not all Muslims are suicide bombers, but virtually all suicide bombers are Muslims.
Eric
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Old 06-27-2008   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

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Originally Posted by Rasczak View Post
What percentage of suicide bombers who've killed in the last five years are Muslim? What most people get, is that not all Muslims are suicide bombers, but virtually all suicide bombers are Muslims.
The problem is that there is a discouragingly large number of people who can't distinguish between a large percentage of suicide bombers being Muslim and a large percentage of Muslims being suicide bombers.

Last edited by Iandefor : 06-27-2008 at 07:37 PM.
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Old 06-27-2008   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

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I find the more relevant question to be what percentage of Muslims have also been suicide bombers?
Ok.

How about answering my question now?
Eric
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Old 06-27-2008   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

I don't know the answer to your question.

By the way, that post poorly conveyed what I wanted to say. The new version is better.
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Old 06-27-2008   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Muslim Voters Detect a Snub From Obama

Okay, here's an answer, which I found on the Boston Globe.

Out of a sample set of "all suicide attacks recorded since the contemporary practice was born during the Lebanese civil war in the early 1980s: a total of 315 incidents through 2003, involving 462 suicidal attackers" 57 percent were done in association with secular groups and 43 percent had a "religious affiliation" attached to them.
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