Just wondering why, since everytime you mention socialism or communism most americans go a freaking tirade about how bad it is.

It's a good question. Especially coming from a system which claims to embrace competition, you'd think capitalists would simply take the attitude "may the best system win" ...

However, I think the deeper reason is more to do with American fears. My parents, for instance, hate communism because it's been associated with political systems that have prevented religious freedom. Of course, there's nothing inherent about communism that requires this ...

Do you think it has to do with the fud that has been spread by people such as Ronald Reagan who had denounced communism since the sixties? Also so many people have like Stalin and Mao have called themselves communist's when in reality they were never communists at all, they were dictators who tried using Communism to cover up what their true intentions were.

It has more to do with the centralized power necessary for collectivism to function on any kind of national scale, and the inevitable loss of personal choice and individual rights in a planned economy.

Centralization of power is why you get a Mao or Stalin in a collectivist government. Once you concentrate that type of power, it's just a matter of time before some madman comes along and takes the reigns. You can claim, "that's not communism", but in reality, that's what communism becomes when it's implemented. The road to Hell is paved in good intentions.

Add to that the fact that the United States is a country of individualists, founded by individualists. Our distrust of the state is older than the country, itself.

Interesting points... That probably helped contributed to the current feeling about it ... Reagan did his share to escalate the cold war with Russia as well.

I really don't know why but there was a period of hysteria in the U.S. in the 40's and 50's. A giant McCarthy era witch hunt, where communism became the great evil. Maybe the great depression affected people psychologically. These attitudes still linger.

I do think Stalin and Mao probably deserve the blame ... they did a lot to destroy the image of the ideas, very much the same way George W. Bush has destroyed much of the credibility of the Republican party. Of course, in many ways they were all acting in direct opposition to the core principles.

LordFu: I'm all for decentralizing power as well. Centralized power is just inviting corruption and abuse.

Although I don't see why the ideas of communism can't be combined with a de-centralized form of government .. even democracy. IMO people should be able to decide, even in a collective, how to determine how resources are used,. It's true that this is not what's been done in most previous implementations though.

Because collectivism is incompatible with freedom. It requires forcing people to do things, which is nigh impossible with a decentralized government.

You may be right, LordFu, but that has nothing to do with why the general population hates communism. Most people don't think it through that far. It comes straight out of the cold war. America/democracy are the good guys and Russia/communism are the bad guys. It's just left-over cold war propaganda.

I don't think you're giving people enough credit. If there are knee-jerk reactions, it happens on both sides of this debate. Some people believe government should provide, others believe it should only protect. Neither opinions necessitates being thought through.

And, we're not a democracy.

That depends on what you mean by "people." Some---like you---have thoroughly thought-out reasons for disliking communism. Some people on the other side of the aisle have thought-out reasons too. But by and large nobody thinks a whole hell of a lot. My point is that nobody thinks much at all, and the propaganda during the cold war was "hate communism." There's a different sort of propaganda now, and it's just as dumb.
I didn't say we are. But the going opinion is that we are a democracy.

the communist philosophy is against a centralised government and prefers small local/regional community driven councils.

People hate it because they were taught to hate it in most cases. I'm pretty sure less than 1% of the people in the US which "hate" it have read Das Kapital and/or Das Kommunistische Manifest.

They hate it because they don't know anything about it and rely on the cold war propaganda in their thinking.

Just as LordFu said Communism = centralised government. It's wrong, plain and simple.

I think you'd be suprised how many people in the U.S. who are opposed to collectivism have read those two books. They're usually required reading at some point, if they aren't actively sought before then.

It doesn't require a strong centralized government? Show me an example of where it hasn't. Oh, wait, we're getting back to the "there's never been a communist country" arguement, aren't we.

Well, when you get a "real" communist country going, let me know how you manage to force everyone to comply while maintaining decentralization.

It won't force anyone, but it's like Marx himself said, mankind just isn't ready for it, not ready to share.

It's just that people confuse the soviet Stalinism with the Ideas of Marx.

They share just as much as Capitalism and Communism.

I think the issue is the difference between idealism and practical application of theories. Democracy itself was once an ideal thats never been fully realised.

Marx was an idealist and while his theories can be debated every time they have been put into practice no matter how fully or otherwise it has led to the very restrictions on freedom that Marx would have fought against.

As Marx said the world is not ready to share. It's just not in our nature at this point in our evolution. Hopefully we are heading in that direction.

I doubt evolution is going into that direction. Evolution changes stuff, does not move things 'forward'. Evolution is also rather painful, entire species having to die and all. No doubt that humans will have to take evolution in their own hands at some point, which is a scary, but far in the future prospect.
I dont think a communist system will work in any case either. Capitalism has its pros and cons, and so does socialism. So i think a combination is best.(Not quite excluding the possibility of other flavors of govt.)
BTW i havent read Das Kapital nor Das Kommunistische Manifest. (Actually only animal farm.)

Maybe they just look at communist countries and know they don't want to be forced to live like that?

But that's really not true. Philanthropy was at its highest in the U.S. when the economy was the most free. Its not that people don't want to share. Sharing is when you give something out of generosity, when you are forced to give up your earnings at gunpoint, that is not sharing.

Have you ever watched "Jay-walking" with Jay Leno? Do you actually think the average American knows where Russia is, much less knows anything about how people lived there under communism?

I was listening to Charley Boorman being interviewed about his travels through Africa with Ewan McGregor on motorcycles. He mentioned that the poorest people were the most generous with what little they had.

Seisen, that's easy. Most people want to have freedom and choice.