...

I thought about that too. I figure though they have not much to gain delivering the fear message in this context. Perhaps there is no way for them to do it anymore. Too bad what a handfull of misguided people in one administration can do to a country and the effects it has on the world.

^, ^^,

Al-Qaida was active against the United States long before Bush took office. The Beirut bombing, the bombing of the USS Cole, and the first bomb at the world trade center are examples that immediately jump to mind.

Out of curiosity, do either of you have a copy of the instruction book that Bush was suppose to use, in the event that Al-Qaida flew two airplanes into the World Trade Center? If you do, I'd sure like to see a copy.

Oh, you don't have one? Well, like Bush then, you would have to play it by ear, and do the best you could, right? Do you honestly think that his agenda when he took office, was to spend his entire eight years fighting terrorism?

Frankly, this Bush bashing shit is really getting old, and so far, I haven't seen one logical alternative plan from anyone, as to what to do next, that will stop Al Qaida.

Do either of you have a plan? If so, start talking...

Edit:

Oh, and Matthew, when it comes to protecting my borders and fellow citizens, I don't give a flying **** what a bunch of goat herders in the Middle East think.

As I've said in previous threads, if the Muslims in the Middle East want to live in peace with the rest of the world, they better get Al-Qaida under control themselves, or suffer the inevitable consequences of non action.

I can certainly agree with this.

No, of course not, but invading Iraq would not have been in my playbook without much, much more to go on and I certainly would not have done it as it was done. Would you have?

No, but as we now know, George Bush thought at the time and apparently still thinks god put him there for that reason. It was his fate in his mind.

there are many alternative plans out there to get from where we are now. I personally like Joe Bidens. BTW--Bush and his administration does quite a bit of bashing of their own as does many of this persidents supporters. Shit, it's how he got elected, his supporters bashed Vietnam war veterans, first McCain and then Kerry. It's hard to forgive not supporting our previous troops. There are many in the field right now whom are getting unequivocal support now because it is the politically correct thing to do, but in the future, will they be treated as McCain and Kerry were? If we are going to support our troops, they deserve that support in the context of serving this country for their entire life.


'ouch'! On behalf of all those 'goat herders' out there.

I agree, however what about doing it without killing sooo many innocent people. They are not responsible for what officials and rich people in the middle east decide.

...

Ya think?

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...TwinTowers.jpg

OrangeCrate, I can hear middle east militants say; 'when it comes to protecting my culture from american corporations and all the seemingly bad that goes with this consumerism that is being pushed on our people, I couldn't give a flying **** about a bunch of corporate workers in some big building in the U.S and what they think.

AND;
When america gets its money hungry people under control we may begin to think differently.

Done here.

We need to find out why Al-Quaida is doing what they are doing instead of blaming each side. I think Pakistan has to do with a lot of it, since the U.S. has become buddy-buddy with them.

Whoah, couldn't put it better - or probably even as well - myself. Ditto to everything OrangeCrate wrote.

American corporations?

The likes of Shell, who drill for and refine crude oil in the Middle East?

Halliburton, maybe?

Look at countries like Saudi Arabia, the UAE, Kuwait and Qatar. The UAE, and Dubai in particular, is certainly one of the more liberal countries in the Middle East, and it's also the country with one of the fastest economic growths in the Middle East. That happens for a reason, and it's due to it's association with the Western world.

It's the silly Islamic fundamentalists who are keeping the Middle East held back in the dark ages. The countries which chose to cooperate with the West, and take advantage of the huge amount of money they have tied up in their oil deposits are the ones who are succeeding the most. Investment in the West has brought exponentially-expanding prosperity to places like Dubai.

Placing the blame on American corporations operating in the Middle East is completely assinine.

I still say 9/11 was used as a tool to use fear propoganda, much like we have before.

I never said whether or not it was justified. My point was, assinine or not, it is what I have heard said. Ignoring it is not the way to peace. Understanding it and compromising is how we learn to live within the bounds of mutual respect.

You see the middle east as being "in the dark ages", they don't. What they see is distruction to their values and influence in their governments by outside nations in order to profit a few while the average person toils in sweat and pain. And, anyway, who are we (you or I) to tell anyone which is best for them like a "one size fits all" approach? That, to me sounds contrary to conservative values.

Let me remind me that the headline says: "U.S. intel warns", and of course the rest is just bla-bla. Quite frankly, they are using it manipulate the people. I do not exactly believe the latests bombing attempts in Britain either. "Still, numerous government officials say they know of no specific, credible threat of a new attack on U.S. soil." sounds pretty clear to me.
Were those earlier bomb-attempts in Britain real? Sounds awfully easy to put smoking cars with bombs in them around.
I guess it is a Yes/No debate, hard to research for yourself, have to rely on either news or some other people who might be deluded. I am not willing to get even more drastic and paranoid security measures, which people have clearly shown, have big holes. Like just being able to walk to parked trains, airplanes, buses. There is not really anything that can be do against that, reasonably, i think.
Ye, because all terrorism comes from Al-Qaida... Sure they will say that now..
As I have not yet said in previous threads, if the Americans in the America want to live in peace with the rest of the world, they better get their government under control themselves, or suffer the inevitable consequences of non action.

Like it or not, US government has screwed with foreign countries, and for the worse. Replacing democracies with puppets and all. (Perhaps that is why socialism has not worked, democracy => socialism => kills corporations => US puts puppet)

Did you even read my post, RJ?

In the Middle East, economic wealth in a country inversely correlates with levels of religiosity in said country. Cooperation with Western countries (and thus, usually, dilution of religious rule in the country) allows the states of the Middle East to prosper.

Do you agree?

No, they weren't real. It was a hologram.

Too bad you don't want to consider both sides of an argument. You have to be willing to see your adversaries view point if you want to be fair.

I take a back seat to no one when it comes to loving my country. That is the reason I believe in diplomacy. Like you, I served my country and I have a right to view politics which affects my people as well as others around the globe as I choose.

That would be to hard to see both sides of things.

Yes I did, and no I don't. When the cost is as we are witnessing, where do you see prosperity? Money is not the only asset in life. Most ordinary people value tradition much more. Anything is reletive to itself.

It's pretty sad that after 6 years of bombing and attacks, the U.S. hasn't made a scratch. Something needs to drastically change here. "Staying the course" only makes sense when someone is pointed in the right direction.

IMO, the solution needs to be political: To undermine the political and popular support that Al Qaeda receives.