The University of Michigan is going to install $25,000 worth of footbaths for to accomodate the Muslim ritual of washing the feet.

Opponents say this is a seperation of church and state issue, and/or that the money would accomodate Muslims while other religions aren't being accomodated in a similar way. I don't think they'll be installing Catholic holy water fonts any time soon.

Supporters say that they are being paid for with funds for infrastructure and maintenace renovation, and that secular people and those of other religions would be free to use them.

What do you say?

Footbaths... very well. 25k$ of it... How do they even do it?! Do they mean fountains?

...

I guess now the Muslim students are complaining because they have to use a sink to wash their feet and they say its awkward and unsafe. These things are apparently physically installed.

I know nothing about the Muslim footwashing ritual and despite spending considerable time in a number of Muslim countries I don't think I've ever seen one.

/shrug

hmm afaik taxpayer money won't be used for the foot baths because the $100,000 total bill for the bathrooms is underwritten by a fee students pay for building maintenance.

As they are building 2 totally new bathrooms the foot baths will be an addition to the common sanitary stuff.

If really no taxes are used and the students' council has no objections I think it's fine it's their money.

I mean nothings better than a foot bath in the summer to get a quick refreshment.

That's just as bad. It's the same thing as a tax, but on a smaller scale because it's only applied to the university students. If people want to donate specifically for that reason, then it's fine. But it should not be coming out of general funds.

My point is that is not the government but the students council which decides how to spend their money. So the state and church are still separated.

according to the german media the students don't have any objections and it's their money.

OK. It's not technically the state. But public universities should be separated from the church just as much as the state should.

Oh, and I doubt the students' council has much say in it. Mostly, it's the administrators that make these kinds of decisions. And even if they did, the students' council doesn't represent the entire student body, they only represent a particular minority of students who participate in student government as an extra-curricular activity. In my experience, the student government is a powerless organization designed to pad the resumes of those who are into that sort of thing.

oh did not know that, I thought they'd been elected by the students and have some powers how their money is spent like at the university I was attending.

But I still think as long as the students don't have any objections it's fine.

It's not a Mosque they are building, but some sanitary devices. they are not going to provide religious teachings but allow some of the students to follow their religions duties.

If they won't allow such foot baths because of the separation of state and religion they should also ban necklaces with crosses on them on the campus or the bible from the library.

No, I'm fine with the foot baths being there, I just wouldn't want MY money -- as a student -- to go to pay for them. I would also be against the school fees paying for crosses or bibles for students, but typically people provide their own.

Here's an example of student government. I've been to two different universities, and at both of them there was a sign at every classroom that said "No food or drink in classroom." The signs are there because the student government wanted them there. I've never heard one single student say anything at all that would indicate they didn't want to be allowed to eat and/or drink in a classroom. Now, most students are respectful of the students and professors, but pretty much we ignore the signs. Nobody enforces it, and nobody cares. It's unwanted, unnecessary, and unenforced. That's pretty typical of student government. The things that matter are out of their hands; all they usually manage is to do useless things that nobody else cares about.

bns has the right of it, unfortunately, at least at my school... student government is there to make the kids who want to be politicians happy. They don't really do much of anything. Most of the time they don't even make quorum, which I believe is 12% of the student population.

All in all, I don't think that it is a good use of university spending, whether or not it's paid for by the students. The school doesn't stop guideons from handing out bibles on campus, so I suppose it'd be fair if they'd let a similar organization install foot baths, but if the school started paying money for bibles in all the rez rooms then I'd be pretty unimpressed.

As to the "a foot bath is refreshing on a hot day", do you think that non-muslim students wouldn't get dirty looks from the muslim students for using their foot bath for a non-religious purpose?

The foot bath itself isn't a special religious symbol. They don't have to use a foot bath, they just have to wash their feet. It's not like foot baths are holy for Muslims lol

Muslims in deserts for example wash their feet with sand.

some use wet cloth while sitting on a chair.

It's just to make it more comfortable.

would you rather like seeing students using foot baths to wash their feet than students using the sink to do so?

I'm curious, MRiGnS, how is this different from spending tax money on a Mosque? To me, it's exactly the same, except that it's on a smaller scale.

A mosque is a religious place whereas a foot bath is just a sanitary device used to wash your feet, accidentally faithful Muslims have to wash their feet before the prayer.

They will wash their feet anyway, so why don't make it more comfortable also everyone can will have the advantage of the foot bath.

OK. That makes sense. I don't agree that it's nothing more than a public foot bath, but based on that I agree with the rest of what you say.