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Old 05-11-2007   #1 (permalink)
brandx
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Default Gun control.. your thoughts?

I'm interested to see what others opinions are.
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Old 05-11-2007   #2 (permalink)
panickedthumb
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

I hate guns, but people should be allowed to have them, BUT to protect the citizens restrictions should be placed on them (for those convicted of violent crimes) and you should have to register it (just like you do your car) and get training on it (just like a car)
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Old 05-12-2007   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

Surely there is a human right to defend oneself in one's own home. 2nd Amendment aside, one of the core tenets of libertarianism (a philosophy which I believe in) is very individualistic: I should be able to do what as I want as long as I am not taking away the rights of others. Possessing a gun in my own home for defense, hunting, or simply for the fun of it does not hurt anyone else. Please don't reply that accidents happen in homes with guns. Many times more children drown in their swimming pools per annum than die or are injured from gun accidents in their homes.

Everyone interested in gun rights/crime, etc. should read John Lott's book: More Guns, Less Crime.
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Old 05-12-2007   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

I'm also very interested to see what people here think about gun control.

In my country, gun is *strictly* prohibited. I've never seen a gun for my life and it would be impossible to own one even if I wanted to. Voters, politicians, and industries all agree with this gun control and there is no debate about it.
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Old 05-12-2007   #5 (permalink)
PWill
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

Oh dear. I remember MY thread about this on the Ubuntu forums. It reached over 50 pages, IIRC.

Anyway, I don't own a gun, but I 100% support the right to own them. A gun is a tool used to protect one's life, liberty and prosperity. The government's job is to protect your life, liberty and prosperity; thus, the government cannot take guns away.

Last edited by PWill : 05-12-2007 at 11:46 AM.
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Old 05-12-2007   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

I personally own several guns which I use to shoot at the shooting range and for hunting.

I support mild gun control in the form of more stringent background checks and the like, but I do feel that making them too strict would infringe upon my Second Amendment rights.
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Old 05-12-2007   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

I think every gun owner should learn proper control of their firearm. If you can't be responsible to use it in a controlled, careful manner, you shouldn't use it at all.
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Old 05-12-2007   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

I support gun ownership, and I own a few myself. Obviously, we should make every effort to keep guns out of the hands of felons and the mentally ill. Basically, if we enforced the laws we have, we'd have fewer problems. All of my family and most of my friends are also responsible gun owners.
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Old 05-12-2007   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

I think that the way gun control within The Netherlands is enforced works quite well.
In general you are not allowed to own a firearm, if you need it for your work you have to leave the weapon at your work, you will not own the weapon yourself. In some functions you are allowed to own your own gun, this is of course registered and these people are trained very well. If you need a gun for sports, you have to be a member of a shooting club and only after a year you are allowed to receive an permit, if the government allows it. Then there are a lot of rules on how to keep it, you are not allowed to keep the weapon and ammo in the same safe nor are you allowed to transport the weapon and ammo together. And many more small rules that I don't know about.

Kills by gunfire are no issue here, they happen of course but not very often and mostly within the criminal environment were nobody pays attention to rules anyway.

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Old 05-12-2007   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

I'm aware the following sentence will ruffle some feathers but here it is. I'm sick of Americans going on about their Second Amendment rights as if they were some sort of divine law granted from the heavens by God* Himself.

A strong constitution is a Good Thing (TM) it helps prevent people's rights being alienated, but just because it's in the constitution doesn't make it reasonable. Surely it's time that we realised that this is no longer the 18th-century civilisation in which the constitution was written; there's no need for average citizens to be carrying guns.They generate a climate of fear and suspicion, and there's just no need for their presence. The one thing that really trumps, as I see it, any argument that we need guns for whatever purpose, is that guns are designed for the sole purpose of killing living things, usually humans. The presence of firearms in American society is much like the presence of nuclear weaponry on the world scale, Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD) and all that. If no-one had them, no-one would need them.

*I'm an atheist but you know what i mean

edit: hieronymus that sounds like it makes a lot of sense to me

Last edited by Moniker42 : 05-12-2007 at 11:52 AM.
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Old 05-12-2007   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

People should be allowed to do anything that doesn't harm another person. Owning a gun is one of these things.
“There can be but little liberty on earth while men worship a tyrant in heaven.”- Robert Green Ingersoll
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Old 05-12-2007   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

The second amendment is there to allow the people to protect themselves from the government. It was important then, and it's important now.

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Old 05-12-2007   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

@moniker42: The problem with what you're saying is that you're looking at rights incorrectly. The people should not have to justify their rights to the government. The burden of proof falls on the government when rights are to be restricted. The Government should have to justify every piece of legislation that restricts rights. If that restriction cannot be justified, then the rights should not be limited. Therefore, even if what you said (that there is no need for guns anymore) were true, it wouldn't matter because there is no justifiable reason to limit household gun ownership except to make gun control advocates feel good inside.

Last edited by strabes : 05-12-2007 at 12:10 PM.
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Old 05-12-2007   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

I am anti-gun control.
I own serveral guns myself

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Amendment II
A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.
Quote:
It is in vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, Peace, Peace—but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! The next gale that sweeps from the north will bring to our ears the clash of resounding arms! Our brethren are already in the field! Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!

-- Patrick Henry
March 23, 1775.
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Old 05-12-2007   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moniker42 View Post
They generate a climate of fear and suspicion, and there's just no need for their presence. The one thing that really trumps, as I see it, any argument that we need guns for whatever purpose, is that guns are designed for the sole purpose of killing living things, usually humans.
Do guns generate fear and suspicion, or do you generate fear and suspicion?

Also, yes, guns are made for killing, but there are certain times when killing is acceptable.
If a man comes into your house and puts a gun to your child's head, and you have a gun in your hand, what do you do?
"A little rebellion now and then is a good thing; the tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -Thomas Jefferson

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Old 05-12-2007   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

I strongly support the second amendment. I don't see how anyone, no matter which side of the political spectrum they are on, can feasibly argue against it. Even the crazy hollywood people that are always bashing gun rights have body guards with GUNS. If the government starts going down that road, then the red blooded Americans of this country should remind them why the second amendment was written.
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Old 05-12-2007   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

I believe in gun control. I'll control my gun and you control yours!
the "VA Massacre" wouldn't have happened if 1) anybody could have returned fire 2) the feds had not told the local cops to stand down. They told them it was a federal issue. I think it was a CIA Zombie-training exercise.
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Old 05-12-2007   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by saphil View Post
I believe in gun control. I'll control my gun and you control yours!
the "VA Massacre" wouldn't have happened if 1) anybody could have returned fire 2) the feds had not told the local cops to stand down. They told them it was a federal issue. I think it was a CIA Zombie-training exercise.
It also wouldn't have happened if it were so easy to get guns. Cho had been hospitalized for being a danger to himself, yet it didn't turn up in background checks.

As I've said before, people should be allowed to have guns, but it should be DAMN sure that they are safe with it before they get it.
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Old 05-12-2007   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by panickedthumb View Post
As I've said before, people should be allowed to have guns, but it should be DAMN sure that they are safe with it before they get it.
Correction, it should be shown that they are UNSAFE before they are disallowed from getting a gun.

Innocent until proven guilty, and all that.
“There can be but little liberty on earth while men worship a tyrant in heaven.”- Robert Green Ingersoll
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Old 05-12-2007   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gun control.. your thoughts?

Guns seem to have become more of a tool in releasing anger and making a statement on his/her/their beliefs. Stricter gun enforcement might be the only method on stopping individuals who wish to inflict harm on others for whatever reasons may be. I am not saying people shouldn't have guns, but the ones you should never obtain them are having an easy time doing so.

Stricter guidelines could include extensive background checks, psychology tests, and better reference checks. I personally despise guns, but people who want them should continue to have the right in obtaining them. However, better enforcement on who receives guns can ultimately lead to saving innocent lives.
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